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Author Topic:   PenIs Redesign Discussion
eod
TREAT MERIGHT!
posted 03-17-2001 21:01     Click Here to See the Profile for eod   Click Here to Email eod     Edit/Delete Message Reply w/Quote
Ok it's obvious that the pen mainpage needs a redesign and since we run this site for the readers, I want to hear your input on what changes you'd like to see in the redesign. This could be anything from purely lyout/cosmetic shit, to new content sections or organization of current sections/information. Got mad design layout skills? Join us..

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LaMFear
Dutch Pen - Cock sucking champ of 1999
posted 03-17-2001 21:07     Click Here to See the Profile for LaMFear   Click Here to Email LaMFear     Edit/Delete Message Reply w/Quote
Contact FaRaN.
He has a degree in Interface Design and he's good at what he does.

(http://www.penismightier.com/ubb/ubbcgi/ubbmisc.cgi?action=getbio&UserName=FaRaN)

[This message has been edited by LaMFear (edited 03-17-2001).]

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hussain
S4d4m Hussain, 1st General, IRC & Script Kiddie Division
posted 03-18-2001 01:33     Click Here to See the Profile for hussain   Click Here to Email hussain     Edit/Delete Message Reply w/Quote
might wanna get zeb onboard. he's got "mad" design skills. heh

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FaRaN
Member with a member bigger than the member with a member
posted 03-18-2001 07:29     Click Here to See the Profile for FaRaN   Click Here to Email FaRaN     Edit/Delete Message Reply w/Quote
Euhm... *blush*...

Yes I pay him to say such things...
Thank you LaMFear.

My suggestion: Redo it all. Go for a clean new look! Or a dirty one...

At least don't use purple anymore please...

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Jimbo
1 dr3w j00 4 p1ggy!

posted 03-18-2001 13:16     Click Here to See the Profile for Jimbo   Click Here to Email Jimbo     Edit/Delete Message Reply w/Quote
I just want you to make Fen redo that Flash header so that the lower portion of the "s" isn't filled in like somebody broke the stencil when they were coloring.

(The vertical Kanji scroll is tight, though.)

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Shir0t
unregistered
posted 03-18-2001 15:18           Edit/Delete Message Reply w/Quote
For a site that takes pride in it's geek roots it sure has some bad design going for it. Scrolling kanji=hack graphics job. How about getting rid of the purple and doing something edgy and unusual? Anyone can throw up a site with a few frames and a flash animation.

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fenomas
argument nazi
posted 03-18-2001 18:26     Click Here to See the Profile for fenomas   Click Here to Email fenomas     Edit/Delete Message Reply w/Quote
Hey, let's everyone talk about me, shall we?

Vertical scrolling kanji = hack design job
..that's a good one, let me try:

fenomas != designer;
fenomas = web developer;
fenomas.skillset = new Array();
fenomas.skillset.push ("flash actionscript");
fenomas.skillset.push ("cgi");
fenomas.skillset.push ("php");
fenomas.skillset.push ("programming");

Probably I should change the whole thing back to when the top was a flat ugly banner with gay photoshop buttons on the left, right? And what was I thinking, purple? Oh wait, I didn't choose the purple.
While I'm at it, shall I kill that whole automated posting/password/show-10-posts-at-a-time thing I rigged up in php, so we can go back to the days of a 300-post frontpage where every post is a different font family and size and 9 out of 10 posts are "finally I was able to ftp into bla-bla and post" or some variant thereof? Because that would sure beat scrolling kanji and a flash banner.

ps - Yeh- I never could figure out why flash4 insisted on filling part of that "s". I thought maybe it was just my machine.

pps - There is NO kanji on the penismightier page. If you don't know what kanji is perhaps you should not criticize it.

} //end flame

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Jimbo
1 dr3w j00 4 p1ggy!

posted 03-18-2001 18:33     Click Here to See the Profile for Jimbo   Click Here to Email Jimbo     Edit/Delete Message Reply w/Quote
quote:
pps - There is NO kanji on the penismightier page. If you don't know what kanji is perhaps you should not criticize it.

Is it okay to say "the kanji part is tight" if it turns out you can't correctly identify kanji?

edited to note that I think the "s" issue is due to the vector-based nature of Flash text, and not having enough nodes for that character. I've seen that in a LOT of Flash projects, not just yours.

[This message has been edited by Jimbo (edited 03-18-2001).]

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Jimbo
1 dr3w j00 4 p1ggy!

posted 03-18-2001 18:56     Click Here to See the Profile for Jimbo   Click Here to Email Jimbo     Edit/Delete Message Reply w/Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Shir0t:
For a site that takes pride in it's geek roots it sure has some bad design going for it. Scrolling kanji=hack graphics job. How about getting rid of the purple and doing something edgy and unusual? Anyone can throw up a site with a few frames and a flash animation.

Incidentally, "geek roots" doesn't mean "airbrushing the living shit out of everything in Photoshop." "Geek roots" - which, considering the vast number of techs and programmers of one sort or another both in the crew and readership, is pretty well assured - can be seen in the presence of a hell of a lot of original code on this site, from Fen's php update script and Flash stuff to Weis' image script to my hacks in this UBB.

Not that I'm a PenIs staff member or anything, but fucking christ people - I think some of you are seriously misled as to what is "tech" and what is "teenager with more time than coding ability."

</rant>

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Jimbo
1 dr3w j00 4 p1ggy!

posted 03-18-2001 19:07     Click Here to See the Profile for Jimbo   Click Here to Email Jimbo     Edit/Delete Message Reply w/Quote
Constructive input:

The BBS and the message board both need their links to stand out more - a LOT more - on the main page. Perhaps move them over to the left side, in the Flash section? Or at least separate 'em out a little bit, 'cause they definitely get lost over there on the right.

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fenomas
argument nazi
posted 03-18-2001 20:31     Click Here to See the Profile for fenomas   Click Here to Email fenomas     Edit/Delete Message Reply w/Quote
Jimbo-
You are a rational prince among men. My php thing was hack from start to finish. Your ubb hacks are rad- from someone who has seen what a stock ubb looks like. And saying "the kanji is tight" - I have no problem with that at all!
No, seriously, you're right all over the place. The message board is the most active part of this site, and deserves linking more prominently than, say, the crapper. And I don't know when geek culture became design-savvy. Perhaps the naysayers would like to go over to once-upon-a-forest.com and revel in the glorious geekdom.
The thing is, I have a design rep these days and I'm working overtime on a personal site to live up to it.. And I'm trying to get it done in time for may reboot (from threeoh.com). So I'm swamped.
However, with this ubb you have officially contributed far more to the site than josh, so we think of you as one of the family, and you're welcome to marry my sister anyday.

fen

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fenomas
argument nazi
posted 03-18-2001 20:39     Click Here to See the Profile for fenomas   Click Here to Email fenomas     Edit/Delete Message Reply w/Quote
Oh-
Japanese has three written alphabets- hiragana and katakana are the two distinct phonetic character sets (46 apiece) which stand for syllables (a, ka, sa, and so on). They are redundant, like upper and lowercase english letters. Hiragana is used for normal writing and katakana is used for terms of foreign origin, scientific context, and so on.
Kanji is the third, mostly borrowed from Chinese, and is ideogrammatic, not phonetic. This means that the characters stand primarily for meanings, not sounds. Of course they each have one or (usually) many sounds associated with them. There are 1945 kanji approved for official everyday communication, but an educated Japanese will know anywhere from 2,500 to 4,000 or so.
As you can imagine, kanji are visually far more complex that hiragana or katakana. Kanji are dense blocks of strokes. Hiragana look like simple letters made of flowing strokes, while katakana are also simple but formed of straight, angular strokes.

The stuff in the pen banner is katakana. It is a transliteration of pen is mightier, but it comes out pen-izu-maitiya. The reason it is "izu" and not "iz" is because japanese is composed of syllables, not letters. N is the only exception, so apart from n, Japanese cannot represent final consonants.

Just for those that are curious.

fen

edit=> Remember the green visual stuff from the matrix? All the little green characters were either numbers or katakana characters. They're mirror images, though.

[This message has been edited by fenomas (edited 03-18-2001).]

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seonaidh
PenIs
posted 03-18-2001 21:22     Click Here to See the Profile for seonaidh     Edit/Delete Message Reply w/Quote
For what it's worth, I think the 'issues' and 'priceless' buttons are worth keeping at least.

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Whistler
unregistered
posted 03-18-2001 22:04           Edit/Delete Message Reply w/Quote
Are you referring to the ad banners?

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eod
TREAT MERIGHT!
posted 03-18-2001 22:09     Click Here to See the Profile for eod   Click Here to Email eod     Edit/Delete Message Reply w/Quote
Since when did geeks become good designers?

Fen: I think the main issue with the purple color is we have about 15 different shades of it.

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fenomas
argument nazi
posted 03-18-2001 22:40     Click Here to See the Profile for fenomas   Click Here to Email fenomas     Edit/Delete Message Reply w/Quote
Eod-
Believe me, I would not shed any tears for the loss of the purple. Our CEO loves purple so half the shit where I work is purple, and half of everything else is lime green to go with it. I have no problem with losing the purple.

May I remind everyone that when I remade the main pages I made them specifically to be easy to redesign

fen

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kokinolimoneiki
Member with a member
posted 03-18-2001 22:49     Click Here to See the Profile for kokinolimoneiki     Edit/Delete Message Reply w/Quote
I think the right side should go away, or at least better organized.. I know things get added on every so often, but it's super crowded and hard to find the message board..
Mayhaps put it all by subject on the left, and you could even leave the BBS and message board by themselves (to be more prominent)
just a thought, or three...

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kokinolimoneiki
Member with a member
posted 03-18-2001 22:57     Click Here to See the Profile for kokinolimoneiki     Edit/Delete Message Reply w/Quote
cont'd --- sorry, jimbo... I didn't catch your thoughts on the board and BBS, good thinking by the by
P.S.- MightyMon agrees, and his will is LAW

[This message has been edited by kokinolimoneiki (edited 03-18-2001).]

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nuentoter
Hey look at me I got arrested for selling warez......... SIKE!! I'm a sneaky fuck
posted 03-18-2001 23:13     Click Here to See the Profile for nuentoter   Click Here to Email nuentoter     Edit/Delete Message Reply w/Quote
i think i good idea would be to have a different banner of course but for menu's make 2 linked flash menus
one has category's other has sub categories, subcategories space is empty until you mouseover onto the category you choose,
put the category menu on the bottom left the subcat menu above it on the left.
and change the colors ehh the purple has become to redundant. try a metalic look or something? i dunno

i been playing waaayyy too much tfc this weekend --
like 30 hours since friday or sumthing

im such a loser

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eod
TREAT MERIGHT!
posted 03-19-2001 00:06     Click Here to See the Profile for eod   Click Here to Email eod     Edit/Delete Message Reply w/Quote
I've been working on a mailing list for those who are interested in helping on this redesign. If you'd like to be part of this (just to watch in and throw in your comments or you have made design skills and would like to help out) throw me an email.

eod@penismightier.com

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Jimbo
1 dr3w j00 4 p1ggy!

posted 03-19-2001 00:21     Click Here to See the Profile for Jimbo   Click Here to Email Jimbo     Edit/Delete Message Reply w/Quote
quote:
Originally posted by fenomas:
You are a rational prince among men. My php thing was hack from start to finish.

Which, unfortunately, is a lot further away from "start" than my own non-existent update script... I think I first swore I was going to make one "first chance I get" about a year ago. (This weekend marks another weekend that I was "absolutely, positively going to get a script written.")

Part of the difficulty was figuring out how I was going to make the damn thing handle archives, but I think I've finally got that licked: I'll generate a static HTML index page with each update, but leave the archives dynamically generated directly from the script.

Is php any easier/better to work with than Perl? I frickin' hate dealing with Perl, but so far it's been all I've really had a chance to work with.

quote:
Perhaps the naysayers would like to go over to once-upon-a-forest.com and revel in the glorious geekdom.

I was thinking of www.koreanpride.com as an example of "airbrushed to glossy 'perfection', but certainly not exemplary of geek culture". Don't get me wrong, Tae's got skills, but... erm... well, if you've ever been there, what I'm talking about is painfully obvious.

quote:
However, with this ubb you have officially contributed far more to the site than josh, so we think of you as one of the family, and you're welcome to marry my sister anyday.

Woohoo! I'm a PenIs!

Now I just have to figure out whether I'd rather get you to hook me up with your sister, or a Japanese chick. Mmmmm, tasty tasty ipponjin...

quote:
Japanese has three written alphabets...

Heh - the only reason I knew the word "Kanji" was from playing Japanese fight games like The Last Blade... I'd just sort of assumed that "Kanji" meant "Japanese writing" and left it at that. Well, you know what GI Joe said about knowing... thanks for the lesson, I like becoming less insular when possible.

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fenomas
argument nazi
posted 03-19-2001 03:12     Click Here to See the Profile for fenomas   Click Here to Email fenomas     Edit/Delete Message Reply w/Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Jimbo:
...

Jimbo - that is just how I did the stuff here- one dynamically created static html page and archives from php. PHP is very similar to perl, but infinitely easier to use because the syntax is more like most languages, and because it gets stuck into the code like SSI tags. So html is just html, rather than long document.writes where if you forget to escape a quote you're fucked.

I see what you mean about koreanpride, but it seems lame to me. just two logos, and then long flat shitty design.

oh, and:
:lewinsky) <---- hilarious!

fen

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FaRaN
Member with a member bigger than the member with a member
posted 03-19-2001 04:25     Click Here to See the Profile for FaRaN   Click Here to Email FaRaN     Edit/Delete Message Reply w/Quote
I have the slightest idea fenomas don't want his site to be redesigned. Maybe we should bring it in a different, easier way. First clean the whole thing up.

Begin with 'thightening' the logo, as this is a new word I learned only here Like the 'S', different font please, etc . Then do something about the buttons on the left. They are just... not nice... (font) And indeed use one ore two shades of purple if insisting on using this color.

Clean it up in a professional way, the content is great, but it looks like a site quickly designed. Give it more attention.

Sorry fen. I hate to have critics on my designs too. But like my mother always says: "Life ain't about roses"
(does it make any sense? Translate from Dutch, but there it doesn't make sense too.. )

Eod, how do you see this design-team working? Everybody mailing you a frameset with a l33t design? Or what?

Grz FaRaN

[Edit: my english sucks]

[This message has been edited by FaRaN (edited 03-19-2001).]

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fenomas
argument nazi
posted 03-19-2001 07:47     Click Here to See the Profile for fenomas   Click Here to Email fenomas     Edit/Delete Message Reply w/Quote
FaRaN-

This is all really simple:

1. It's not my site.
2. I think it is in bad need of a redesign.
3. I would be thrilled if people would send in design ideas - although working html/css or layout demos in psd/ai/fla would be SLIGHTLY more helpful than "choose different fonts".
4. I would be less thrilled for another ninety people to think of things currently wrong with the site and then blame them on me. When I did the current design, there was no bbs or message board. The site has changed a little bit.
5. I never claimed to be a good designer. I do say that I could recreate any flash site that you have ever seen, given enough time and all images in ai format. I'd say that I can implement just about anything you can think of if it can be done with html, dhtml, js, css, php, cgi, etc. But I never said I was a good designer. The top logo was in purple Impulse when I arrived, and it is in purple Impulse now.

I hope that's all clear. I'm not trying to flame anyone. I just happen to be (in my own small way) in the web business myself and I don't see why all the faults of this site are mine. Yes, we have twenty shades of purple. As far as I know I only put two of them here. This site is an effort of many people that has evolved over time. You probably weren't here back when every post had a different colored header.

agghhh. It's 9:30 and I'm at work.

Basically, please send in designs. We will be happy. If you send in too many, we will rig up multiple layouts and let people choose. If you are really eager to help we'll probably give you ftp access. Just stop everyone telling eod to "make fen change his fonts" please.

faran, this isn't all at you. I'm just in a bad mood cuz this ubb looks so rad.

fen

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FaRaN
Member with a member bigger than the member with a member
posted 03-19-2001 08:28     Click Here to See the Profile for FaRaN   Click Here to Email FaRaN     Edit/Delete Message Reply w/Quote
Alright I'm gonna don inflammable clothing next time I give suggestions when asked for.

I tried to help fen. Maybe you should go outside and have some fun or something. take the day off.

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