The Unlimited WHO says it wasn't accidentally released from any Labs.

Opinions welcomed.

I haven't had the time to process the scholarly articles published in China during the interval[12/1/19 - 6/20] with a mindfulness of interlinkedness and references to 'THIS VIRUS WAS NOT RELEASED FROM A LAB'


  • I liked the half baked theory about the lab worker selling test animals to the market, but if the release was intentional it would be sloppy and stupid to just squirt some out the back door of the lab in your own country.

  • The Wrath of Pengolin is the most believable potetnially edible source for the species hop:

  • dang thing looks like a badger fucked an artichoke

  • What do you do with all those scales from a Pengolin? Like don't waste it. Do you make a leather armor of sorts. Does it take on leather armor atributes? What is leather armour (I added a u for classy), light weight +1 AC?

  • Is it scale mail?

  • @eod said:
    Is it scale mail?

    Sure looks like it.

  • Armored Sloth ... wonder what it tastes like

  • Baby Ruth

  • edited February 2021

    I'm afraid to actually look it up... but do people actually eat the pangolin meat?

    I know the scales are used in traditional medicine. Or boner pills. Whichever. But I'm curious how frequent eating the dang things actually is.

    The fact they're in danger of extinction probably just adds to the allure.

  • The Wet Animal Market Scene:
    _ in China_ :wink: reminds me of the time Lam, Doomy and I got wrecked on Whiskey Ice Cream Shakes at Six Flags while arguing about who gets to go first. :blush:

    Those were the days....

  • Somewhere there exists some scanned pictures of you guys in front of your car during that trip. I swear I saw them recently, just don't recall when. I know Lam was always great about taking pictures.

    That said, I'm more surprised she was willing to touch whiskey at that point in time. I know by the time I got to know her she was abstaining.

  • edited March 2021

    I'll improve on the quality of these postings as I regain my experience.

  • Like falling off a bike.

  • I watched this one:

    There may be a way to blame tourists too.

  • They were already blaming tourists.

    (Wait, you didn't meant the white tourists, did you?)

  • Crosspost: The origin of COVID: Did people or nature open Pandora’s box at Wuhan? By Nicholas Wade

    Note that Nicholas Wade is a serious person, not some crank.

  • I just read his wikipedia page and I'm not convinced that your note is correct.

  • sigh

    It’s important to note that so far there is no direct evidence for either theory.

    (emphasis his)

    Well, at least he got that out of the way quickly. That is the best part of the article. Especially since I see articles every week where biologists/etc are emphasizing the need to discover the origin of the virus (including a recent open letter published in Science magazine).

    So, I'll concede that he is a serious person. But I'll amend that with I believe that he is a serious crank person. ;-)

    He points out that the wet-market connection has been disputed due to the virus appearing in other places beforehand, and yet isn't clear about how this would tie to exposure to the Wuhan lab. Considering how he focuses so much on others 'certainty' his logical leaps on this matter is telling. In my opinion he is guilty of doing the same thing he criticized other articles for. I do think he should have made it clear he was using 'Wuhan lab' as shorthand for any virological study in the province before most of the way through the article, but at least he finally got there. It was irresponsible to not have that disclaimer after the first or second mention.

    He gets points for not naming Obama directly in his criticism of WHO funding. Or naming Bill Gates directly in criticism of research. Pleasant surprise considering where I felt it was going based on tone.

    Regarding the author... Even during his time with the NYT, he has storied history of attacking anything he sees as a left-leaning political agenda in science. He has reportedly attacked the scientific method using examples of past hoaxes such as the Piltdown man. [Note: This is according to a few synopses of his early work (pre-2000) that were mostly neutral]. He is clearly not a fan of how peer reviews work, and that is further reflected by his comments on this article. His reputation for hating the peer review process goes back to the early 1980s.

    Funny enough, his controversial stance probably helped with his career as an editorial writer at the NYT during that point in time.

    As an aside: Furin Cleavage sounded a lot more sensational than it turned out to be. :-)

    Also avoid the comments on this article if you value your sanity. Jesus Christ.

  • I've read everything everyone posted and my thank to Bill for this nice find:

    One point I think the author makes with an really interesting set of linkages is the measurable iterative distance from published research to the virus in question. In my simple opinion, its pretty effin close.

    I am starting the funny article referenced in this article tonight.

  • If it was a lab leak, I fully believe that the Chinese government will successfully suppress enough evidence to a point where we will never know where it came from.

  • Ya, I don't really see the "importance" of this investigation. Either it was a lab leak - in which case China will bury it, a "test run" - in which case China will bury it, or a natural transmission that got out of control due to local governments suppressing info on it early on - in which case China will bury it.

    Better to work on all the worst case assumptions - that lab protocols need to be tightened up, that another virus like this or worse could cross from animas at any time, or that this could have been a "test run. Regardless, infrastructure to handle it needs to be a lot more ready when it happens again, and we need to be ready to write off 30% of the population who will ignore every warning in the name of "freedom," and the other 50% they will probably take down with them.

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